Author Topic: Hose Source / General Maintenance  (Read 2824 times)

Achilles

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Hose Source / General Maintenance
« on: September 25, 2006, 08:14:45 AM »
Hi all,
I'm anticipating the reinstallation of my differential.  Effectively no service has been done to this unit for many years.   It hasn't been run for nearly 20 years.  What parts that might need to be replaced just because they will have rot while sitting that long?

Most importantly though, does anyone here know if there is a direct aftermarket source for the various hydraulic hoses (pre-made, that is).  Or should I just take my old hoses to the local fluid power guys and have them reproduce them?

Thanks!
HD '70 Autostick Cabrio Ghia

volkenstein

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Here ya go..
« Reply #1 on: September 25, 2006, 06:28:30 PM »
Achilles,
           A guy on www.thesamba.com in the classifieds is selling good condition OG lines for 15 US each. Have look and just search on "auto". They'll pop up.

You can take your old hoses to a hydraulics shop and they'll re-use your ends and whack them on new hoses. Really up to you.

20 years? Was the transaxle oil drained? In various discussions about Hypoid Oils, you may have rotted brass bits but I'm not sure. I'd yank the trans sump plate and check for rust on the R & P. Check the axle flange bearings for roughness (hell, any of them!).

Check your gear selection (Is the trans in or out of the car?).

Drain your torque converter, flush the tank and steel lines..basically get rid of 20 year old fluids.

Your vacuum hoses to/from the CV & servo are available from www.belmetric.com Part no RH12W. Cloth covered vacuum hose is ok for Carby to small CV spigot. Spray WD40 or equivalent on all the hose clamps as they may have rusted shut. Figure on breaking at least one.

AND...has the motor been started in the last 20 years? I'd be concerned about the condition of your oil/atf pump seals if it hasn't been running.


HTH
Volkenstein
1 Super RHD Semi-Auto "Klaus"

Achilles

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Hose Source / General Maintenance
« Reply #2 on: September 26, 2006, 05:41:41 AM »
Thanks volksie.

I changed out the gearbox oil several years ago, but the unit then just sat.  It is out of the car, as is the engine.

The engine was run some 5 years ago, briefly.

IIRC (I have check the documentation from the P.O.) the transaxle was rebuilt (don't remember what all that means) sometime before I acquired the car...

Are axle flange bearings available for replacement?
HD '70 Autostick Cabrio Ghia

Crasher

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Hose Source / General Maintenance
« Reply #3 on: September 26, 2006, 05:28:49 PM »
The bearings are available, I recived some today.
ormally known as 1302LS auto

volkenstein

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Axle flange bearings..
« Reply #4 on: September 26, 2006, 05:30:10 PM »
Achilles,
           In the Trans (ie, supporting the Ring gear/diff carrier assembly on both sides), yes. Just typical Timken types. In the outer IRS ARM/Stub axle, yes again they are available.

The trans will need to have backlash re-set if you have to pull the carrier out to replace the timkens.


Volkenstein
1 Super RHD Semi-Auto "Klaus"

Achilles

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Hose Source / General Maintenance
« Reply #5 on: January 04, 2007, 05:38:17 PM »
OK guys, back at this again, got distracted for a time on other issues with the Ghia.  The tranny is out and getting cleaned up and basic maintenance done while the car in the paint shop (yeah!).  So I need to go at this in earnest now.

I have been advised to:

- remove the bell housing and  disassemble the pressure plate from the drive plate, and measure the disc thickness.

-scuff up the pressure and drive plate surfaces with a coarse scotch brite cookie.

- clean everything with brake cleaner and lube the throwout bearing with high temp grease.

- check the ring and pinion for wear and play.

- remove the nose cone (gear housing) to get out all the dirt and cooked oil out of the trans.  Oh yeah the part about me changing out the gear oil some time ago - that turned out to be fiction.  Never happened, or happened to a manual trans I had.  Old age is hell.

- Re-seal everything up with new gaskets and refill the case with gear oil.

How does all that sound?
HD '70 Autostick Cabrio Ghia

volkenstein

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Some other tips..
« Reply #6 on: January 04, 2007, 06:36:17 PM »
Achilles,


- remove the bell housing and disassemble the pressure plate from the drive plate, and measure the disc thickness.

Mark the pressure plates position on the carrier for re-assembly. Maybe not necessary but you never know.
Don't remove the clutch arm if you can help it. Where is the torque converter? If it has been removed, you need a new seal. If it hasn't, strap it into the housing.
Measuring is OK (comparing against what?) but check how much "meat" is left on both sides compared to the rivet height.

-scuff up the pressure and drive plate surfaces with a coarse scotch brite cookie.

Carrier as well for scuffing, check the wear pattern, inner edge vs outer edge of carrier and pressure plate.

- clean everything with brake cleaner and lube the throwout bearing with high temp grease.

Don't spray the T-O rolling part faces with carb cleaner. It's a pre-lubed bearing (internally) and you don't want to wash it out. Wiping external surfaces would be better.
The inner diameter and "arms" should get greased, and don't forget to check the pilot bearing in the carrier plate for lube.

- check the ring and pinion for wear and play.

"Feel" for roughness in the bearings while rotating.

- remove the nose cone (gear housing) to get out all the dirt and cooked oil out of the trans. Oh yeah the part about me changing out the gear oil some time ago - that turned out to be fiction. Never happened, or happened to a manual trans I had. Old age is hell.

You may as well replace the nosecone inner bush and outer bush/seal.

- Re-seal everything up with new gaskets and refill the case with gear oil.

A trans guy on STF (Bruce and he are pretty much trans guru's) advised using Castrol LSX90 as a preferred poison rather than VMX80.

Hopefully Bruce will chip in, and anybody else!


HTH
Volkenstein
1 Super RHD Semi-Auto "Klaus"

68AutoBug

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Hose Source / General Maintenance
« Reply #7 on: January 04, 2007, 07:21:16 PM »
Hi,
If You can get the throw out bearing apart...
can't remember from memory whether i did with mine or not...

If it could be taken apart then i would have put some nice new Lithium based Molybdenium dilsulphate grease in it...
also use this grease on the small needle roller bearing... and CV Js.

Nose cone inner bush and seal...
are these available Sean??
are the rear axle seals available??
[the gearbox ones??]


and why use LSX90 gear oil? is it synthetic??
the books say Hypoid oil Must be used because of the differential gears.

Don't forget to replace the torque converter oil seal...
as You don't want that leaking....
I was told [originally on here] to change the torque converter every time it was removed....
Well. I replaced it but the torque converter has been out about 6+ times and the same new oil seal is still in there.... but its had no use...
and it wasn't old and Hard as nails....


Lee Noonan  -
ttp://community.webshots.com/user/vw68autobug
--- 68AutoBug  ---  Lee  ---  Australia ---
-- helping keep Air Cooled Volkswagen Automatics on the road -  Around the World --

volkenstein

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Stuff
« Reply #8 on: January 04, 2007, 08:10:07 PM »
Lee,
      Regarding the oil, here is what Pablo replied with :

Castrol LSX90 is touted by a number of European gear manufacturers and transmission builders as the best oil available. Some will only warantee their products when this oil is used. I believe it's a 75/90 weight oil.

The GL4 / GL5 debate is dead (and as I understand it, only pertained to early versions of synthetic GL5 in which excessive sulpher was utilized).

While synthetic oils shift far better (especially prior to full warm-up), nothing beats a high quality mineral-based oil for high pressure metal-to-metal contact. Personally, I'd need a special reason for using a synthetic (extreme cold climate or attempts to harness every last pony in a limited class, etc.)

End of Quote

I got my bushes & seal from EVW parts. I don't think they are different to a manual 4 speed. The outer one yanked off with a bit of twisting, the inner bush required a driver (made it by turning down a bolt head) and hammer action to get it out.

As for disassembling the T-O bearing, you could but that snapring is a real bear to get off. I gave it a go but decided discretion was the better part of valour since it required heavy duty tools which I don't have.

Axle seals (inside the adjuster rings?) I don't know if they are or not. Steve would know for sure.

Regards
Sean
1 Super RHD Semi-Auto "Klaus"

68AutoBug

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Hose Source / General Maintenance
« Reply #9 on: January 04, 2007, 11:09:21 PM »
Yes,

I wish i could remember if i replaced the seals in there...
and I'm presuming there would be some seals in there...??
as MY current gearbox has only done 1500kms since the seals were replaced...[??}
 although its 10 years time wise....
or hopefully they are just standard seals that WE Can Buy Somewhere...

Have You ever changed diffs or adjusted the freeplay in a VW diff??
Is it difficult without measuring VW tools...??

Lee
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--- 68AutoBug  ---  Lee  ---  Australia ---
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Achilles

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Hose Source / General Maintenance
« Reply #10 on: January 05, 2007, 07:07:32 PM »
Sean, Lee: you guys are the shit.  That's a good thing, in case you don't know.

Piles of work to do now......... :lol:  :P
HD '70 Autostick Cabrio Ghia

volkenstein

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Hmm
« Reply #11 on: January 06, 2007, 07:24:29 AM »
Achilles,
           People say I'm full of it, not that I am it :?  :lol:

Volkenstein
1 Super RHD Semi-Auto "Klaus"

Achilles

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Re: Hmm
« Reply #12 on: January 06, 2007, 12:50:52 PM »
Quote from: "volkenstein"
Achilles,
           People say I'm full of it, not that I am it :?  :lol:

Volkenstein
Yeah, I get the 'full of it' line, too.  I don't understand that.  My eyes are green, not brown.  I must be a quart low.

Back on topic though: these seals, gaskets, bushings, I haven't shopped yet and just want to confirm these things are commonly available, and, if I understand this correctly, they are interchangeable with standard transmission parts.

Also, are the electrical switches available?  On mine, the contacts are all there, but they can be corroded or bent.  I'd consider replacement for peace of mind, before putting the unit back in the car.
HD '70 Autostick Cabrio Ghia

volkenstein

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Bit's and pieces
« Reply #13 on: January 06, 2007, 06:53:42 PM »
Achilles,
           I don't really know for sure whether they are interchangeable (gaskets). I'm going to get EVW to send me some and compare with a 4 speed set.

The bushings/seal for the nosecone are in the same boat. I have some from EVW.

I don't know about O-rings in the adjusters or the seals in them either. The plastic caps used in the axle drive flanges are common.

The switches are not. Re-use yours after testing or trawl TheSamba classifieds endlessly  or scour swap meets. You could pick up a donor trans relatively easily.

Seals in all their flavours will be a problem. Mike (Bookwus) got the last fully rebuilt trans that German Transaxle had. They know which ones aren't available so maybe worth a ring.

Steve (Crasher) had to modify to suit available seals or order custom made/standard ones.

In summary I would say do as little as necessary to get it back on the road after examining the box. I guess that sucks, but it may be a long, long time hunting NLA (No longer available) parts.


Volkenstein
1 Super RHD Semi-Auto "Klaus"