I'm am the proud owner of a "new to me" 1970 VW Beetle AutoStick.
The carburetor on this engine has "30PICT-2-3" stamped on the side.
The first few questions I have are:
Exactly which carb do I have? 30PICT-2 or 30PICT-3?
What is the extra port shown in the photo below? Should it be plugged?
(http://i625.photobucket.com/albums/tt333/Warbow_Halo/30pict-2-3.jpg)
The last question deals with the ATF tank. Does anyone have a picture of the mounting bracket? My tank is currently just hanging by the filler tube. I do have the strap that goes around the tank but not the bracket. The missing bracket mounts to the bumper brackets?
I've got plans to move the fuel filter out of the engine bay and also replace the 009 distributor with a more stock distributor. I haven't gotten the engine running with this carburetor yet, it's pretty gummed up. I've ordered a rebuild kit and vacuum caps.
I have found the answer for my last question myself.
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=685712
Hiya War,
Welcome to this corner of the VW neighborhood.
About your tank and bracket........... First off do know that Mark Bolina, the fellow placing the ad in the Samba Classifieds is a first rate seller. I have done business with him and never been disappointed. In fact just the opposite, I have been amazed at both the quality of his parts and the care he puts into them. He is an excellent resource.
If you buy the bracket from Mark you will need another piece. The tank is held to the bracket by a large band-style clamping ring. It is much like the generator strap or a VERY large hose clamp. You might want to ask Mark if he could also supply you with this strap.
And about your carburetor............ From the angle of the picture I really cannot tell if you have a 30PICT2 or a 30PICT3. Your 1970 would have come with a 30PICT3 as original equipment. What is the maker's name? Solex, Bocar, or Brosol?
However, I can tell you that the carburetor you have is most likely not an AutoStick specific carburetor. It looks to be a replacement/original for a car with a manual transmission. I say that because you have the bottom vacuum port (the one near the base flange that angles upward) and that port was NOT present on an AS specific carburetor. That port was intended for use with the throttle positioner on manual transmission cars, but never installed on As cars. It should most definitely be capped.
The vacuum port at 10:00 above the blow-out plug is for use with retard side of a DVDA distributor. This port is almost universally plugged on a 30PICT3 or 30PICT2 as DVDA distributors were not commonly used with this carburetor. The vacuum port on the left side of the carburetor is for hook-up to the advance side of either a DVDA or an SVDA or a vacuum advance only distributor. Since you are now running a 009 it should be capped.
Also, I'm spotting another potential problem in the area of your air cleaner. You have the 1970 original air cleaner (a good thing! - I'm looking for one right now myself!) but the thermostat cable which controls the preheat flap in the air cleaner horn is missing. Without a functioning preheat flap the engine thinks its cold all the time - not good for smooth operation.
I'd definitely say you were on the right track in considering a new distributor for this engine. And moving the fuel filter out of the engine compartment is a very good idea.
Where are you located?
Thank you for your help.
I do have the strap for the ATF tank. I'm missing the bracket because the bumpers where removed and the bracket was misplaced.
As for the maker of the carburetor, it is not on it anywhere that I can see. The only markings on the carburetor are "30PICT-2-3" and "12v".
As for the air cleaner, I'm trying to understand. The air cleaner is supposed to have flap inside the intake horn? Let's assume that my engine still has a working thermostat (I can't confirm or deny at this point). The thermostat links up into Fan shroud. The thermostat cable which controls the preheat flap in the air cleaner horn would link up to a control rod that exits the fan shroud on the right hand side? Does that sound correct?
I'm located in south eastern Ohio about 3 1/2 hours south of Mark Bolina.
Hiya War,
Quote from: Warbow on 10 March 2009, 00:50
As for the maker of the carburetor, it is not on it anywhere that I can see. The only markings on the carburetor are "30PICT-2-3" and "12v".
There should be a maker name (if, indeed, there is a maker name) on the left side of the float bowl........just in front of the vacuum port for the distributor advance.
QuoteAs for the air cleaner, I'm trying to understand. The air cleaner is supposed to have flap inside the intake horn?
You are correct sir.
QuoteLet's assume that my engine still has a working thermostat (I can't confirm or deny at this point). The thermostat links up into Fan shroud. The thermostat cable which controls the preheat flap in the air cleaner horn would link up to a control rod that exits the fan shroud on the right hand side? Does that sound correct?
Spot-on!
QuoteI'm located in south eastern Ohio about 3 1/2 hours south of Mark Bolina.
Hmmm, I think Achilles is in your area.
I pulled the carburetor off and it dosen't have any other markings. If the rebuild kit brings it back to life then I'm not going to worry about it.
As for the air cleaner and preheat flap. My cleaner is missing the whole flap assembly. I'll look around for another cleaner with the assembly but until then what should I do? Should I just run it as-is?
Thanks
Warbow
Hiya War,
In going back and looking at your picture again it does look as if the flaps are missing. It's quite possible that a PO pulled those flaps (there are actually two flaps in the airhorn) because the cable broke or was removed. Truth be told, the really difficult part to obtain in this 1970 preheat set-up is the cable and its connecting parts. That's why many just chucked the 1970 style air filter and went with the 1971 and up air filter style which incorporated its own thermostat thus doing away with the need for a cable set-up.
And do run the air filter as it is now. It is a very good air filter, much better than the aftermarket replacement stuff.
Bookwus
This looks like a 1970 air cleaner, yes? It appears to be missing the cable.
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=534955
I'm not going to buy it but you said you were looking for one. I've got to limit my spending for the short term to appease my wife.
Hiya War,
You are good! I've been haunting the Samba looking for one and the only one I turned up was this one.............
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=727982
Heaven only knows how much the guy wants for that one.
Thanks for the tip.........I think I'm gonna jump that one.
This exactly like my carburetor.
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=748157
I'm still curious whether it is a 30pict-2 or 30pict-3.
Hiya War,
That is a bit of a mystery to me. Looks as though it might be some sort of generic replacement for the 30PICT series carbs. I really dunno. However I have the question in to my source authority. I'm hoping that we can turn up a couple of facts for you.
Hiya War,
I heard back from my "source", Keith over at the Samba. Keith is in the business of rebuilding and rebushing VW carburetors. He is highly respected and knows his stuff. In his words your carburetor is....
"80's model Japanese carb... POS..."
You might want to look at getting another carburetor. Go for a rebuilt AutoStick specific Solex before ANYTHING else. And you might want to contact Keith (keifernet) about that. He can help you to no end.
I'm not surprised it's a POS replacement.
Thank you for your help and I'll keep Keith in mind when I start looking for a replacement.
The good news is that the engine seems to run great when it is bottle feed. But, the more I work on my POS aftermarket carburetor the more convinced I become that it MUST be replaced. That being said, I know that the Solex 30 pict-3 was the original carburetor on my 1970 AS Bug. If I find a decent 30 pict-3, how badly is the 009 distributor going to react with it?
I also found a crack in the vacuum hose going to the vacuum tank and one of the other vacuum hoses has been replaced with a new hose that is so weak that you can pinch it closed with your fingers. I'm going to replace them all. In the "Sources for Autostick Parts" sticky thread, Belmetric RH12W hose is mentioned. Is 2 meters the correct amount to order? I don't want to find out that I'm 3 inches short or that I could have gotten by with only 1 meter. If anyone has ordered from them recently what type of cost are we talking?
I know it sounds like I'm being cheap. In a way I am. I convinced my wife to let me buy this Bug with the logic that this would give our family (me!) another vehicle to drive. Currently all she sees is a non-running vehicle and me crawling all over it stating I need more money for this and that. If I can get this baby moving then I can get the funds moving.
Tonight, I get to pull out the multi-meter and tackle the electrical problems. First up is testing the headlights to see if they are burnt out or whether I have a wiring problem. If it's just burnt out headlights then it's onto the windshield wipers.
Hiya War,
Quote from: Warbow on 18 March 2009, 15:23
The good news is that the engine seems to run great when it is bottle feed. But, the more I work on my POS aftermarket carburetor the more convinced I become that it MUST be replaced. That being said, I know that the Solex 30 pict-3 was the original carburetor on my 1970 AS Bug. If I find a decent 30 pict-3, how badly is the 009 distributor going to react with it?
Correct on the 30PICT3. And do know that the 30PICT3 that was used on AutoSticks is a specific carburetor as opposed to the ones used on manuals. A 30PICT3 intended for a manual can be adapted for use on an AutoStick however.
The 009 can work with the 30PICT3 but you will be much happier either with the original vacuum only distributor or an SVDA.
QuoteI also found a crack in the vacuum hose going to the vacuum tank and one of the other vacuum hoses has been replaced with a new hose that is so weak that you can pinch it closed with your fingers. I'm going to replace them all. In the "Sources for Autostick Parts" sticky thread, Belmetric RH12W hose is mentioned. Is 2 meters the correct amount to order? I don't want to find out that I'm 3 inches short or that I could have gotten by with only 1 meter. If anyone has ordered from them recently what type of cost are we talking?
I believe that 2 meters of hosing is actually a just a bit more than you'll actually need. Somebody out there needs to check me on that however. Belmetric is spendy. I don't recall how much per foot, but I do remember that one person here who had ordered from them said that they charged retail and then there's the shipping also. But it is the original stuff! You might want to check out reinforced hosing at a local hydraulics shop. That may be a cheaper way to go.
QuoteI know it sounds like I'm being cheap. In a way I am. I convinced my wife to let me buy this Bug with the logic that this would give our family (me!) another vehicle to drive. Currently all she sees is a non-running vehicle and me crawling all over it stating I need more money for this and that. If I can get this baby moving then I can get the funds moving.
Man, I hear you! Money don't grow on trees.
QuoteTonight, I get to pull out the multi-meter and tackle the electrical problems. First up is testing the headlights to see if they are burnt out or whether I have a wiring problem. If it's just burnt out headlights then it's onto the windshield wipers.
Best of luck. Let us know if you run into problems.
War,
The hose you're talking about isn't cheap. I bought 2 meters and want to say that it was around 80 with shipping. The hose itself is as close to OEM as you're going to find 30 years after the factory stopped making autosticks. If you're going to order from this supplier, I'd order the two meters. It gives you enough to redo all of the old hose. Once it's done you should be good for another 30 years. If you still want to do just one section, give the guy a call and he may be willing to work with you. I found him to be very easy to work with.
You can find cheaper hose, but you'll need to make sure the inner diameter is correct and that it's wire reinforced so that it won't collapse under vaccum. Others have had issues with standard non reinforced hose. Do a search on this forum, and you'll see the problems others have had.
Dave
Thanks for the replies.
If I'm replacing these hoses, I'm replacing them all. I'll admit that I'm a band-aid kinda guy. But like you said these should last another 30 years. Do the job correctly once instead of 2 times halfway.
Does this look like the correct Brake Warning Light for a 1970 bug?
(http://images.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/pix/2057140.jpg)
I've solved my headlight problem, it's amazing what a good cleaning to the contacts can do. Hope the wipers are that simple.
Warbow
That's the same as on my 70 AS bug so I would say your good with that one.
Bob
Hiya War,
I'd X2 Bob on that, probably. But it just might be a good idea to show us the other end of the assembly.
VW had at two different brake warning lamps. And I notice that yours does not have the "B" stenciled on the red push button lense. The "B" may just have worn off, but it also might be another variation of the brake warning light.
Well, I'd give you a pic of mine if it wasn't just a lightbulb and spring sticking out of my dash. The question is does your brake warning light have a "B" on it?
Hiya War,
The lenses I have in my Bug and my Bus both have the "B".
Here's a picture of a switch and its component parts.........
(http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa85/Bookwus1/Bug/IMG_1266.jpg)
The "exploded" switch is basically correct but you cannot see the spring assembly inside the switch body.
Hey Bookwus
Components on my 70 AS Bug are the same but no screening on the lens. Too much glass cleaner I guess. Where can I find a repalcemnt lense?
Bob
Hiya Bob,
You can have the one in the picture above if you want it. Yes, it does have the "B". Pay the postage and it's yours.
Zap a pm my way.
I've found 2 bugs and I'm hoping to pick one of them up cheap for parts. I haven't got a close look at either of them. Hopefully they have the little things like this brake light.
I fixed the wipers yesterday. I had to remove the assembly and give it a good cleaning. During the process, I broke one of the motor wires and had to solder it back onto the contact.
Sadly that wasn't my stupid act for the day. I closed the trunk lid with the glove box assembly removed. Not horrible but still annoying. I was able to reach in from inside and reattach the cable anchor. Then pull the cable with some pliers. I spent the rest of the day with a roll of duct tape sitting over the latch to prevent a repeat.
Hiya War,
Well, you know, the old saying goes, "experience is the best teacher"
There's a lot of truth in that.
And we've all been in the same situations, believe me!
I was having problems getting fuel to the carb.I hooked up the fuel pump to a gas can and still wasn't getting fuel. I pulled the fuel pump checked the fuel rod throw. Everything looked fine so I reinstalled the pump and the gas can. She started right up. She still doesn't idle right but I had her running for about 5 minutes.
I was so pleased, I tried puttung her in gear. She went and I got so excited I decided to take victory lap around the yard. I forgot she was hooked up to a gas can and she drove off anyway. I suddenly remembered and stopped her. Loaded the gas can behind the drivers seat and drove her around the backyard for about 4 laps. I had to hold the hose in the can but it was no problem since I didn't have to shift. :)
Hiya War,
Yay!
I had to laugh out loud about forgetting the gas can. That reminded me of me!
I've got a rebuilt 30 PICT-3 coming my way. I've read and understand the "Modifying a 34 Pict 3 for semi auto use" in the step by step forum. Will there be any difference between the 30 Pict-3 and the 34 Pict-3? I'm mainly concerned about the depth to drill.
Warbow,
If it has a boss in the correct location then it shouldn't be a problem. If there is no boss to drill into...then you'll have a problem.
Regards
Volkenstein
(http://images.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/pix/2260391.jpg)
It should look exactly like this. The only thing I'm really concerned about it is the 10mm depth. Is there a difference in thickness between the 34 Pict and the 30 Pict.
Hiya War,
Start by drilling into the boss with a 3/16 bit. Drill into the right rear boss (at 1:00 from the blow-out plug in your picture) about halfway through the body of the carburetor. Then complete the hole all the way through to the inside throat (venturi) of the carburetor with a 9/64. The brass vacuum nipple that you will tap into the 3/16 hole will bottom out where the 9/64 hole begins. You can pretty much judge halfway through the body by eyeballing it. However, do be careful when drilling because that steel drill bit will eat through that carb body quickly.
New to the site and can say that i have found many useful posts and have applied them and has fixed most of my problems. I am currently trying to finish a project 70 AS myself. Been on it all winter but having one problem that is stumping me and have not been able to figure out. While vehicle is running and trans shifted into reverse, the engine is killed totally, no matter how hard you try to keep it alive. Seems like the vacuum or electrical is completely cut from the motor. All three forward gears work like a dream and were made that way only due to the information found in these posts, many thanks to all members here !! Rerouting vacuum lines to correct spots helped out a lot but has not cured the motor dying when in reverse. You can still have your hand on the shifter and the vehicle dies, meaning that the clutch doesn't have to engage for this to occur. Just the movement into reverse selection is killing all life. Any points into the right direction would be much appreciated. Also a question of if the reverse lights not working in this scenario would have anything to do with this.
Welcome Bennie
I did a quick search and the following thread may very well have your answer.
http://www.vwar.org/forum/index.php?topic=85.0
Since your reverse lights are not working you may have crossed your reverse lights with the electric idle cut-off valve on the carburetor. This would make sense for the symptoms you have described.
Thank you Warbow for that, i will check into that this evening and report my findings. Poor bug has been sitting for over 13 years with plenty of weathering done to it, not to mention any rodents and/or bug nests found within. With that in mind, who knows what else has been chewed up over the years besides of what i have replaced so far.
Make sure that the only wire on one side of the coil is the one from the distributor. If you hooked up the backup lights to that terminal, the car will die immediately when placed in reverse.
Hiya Guys,
Good calls on the back-up lights not being hooked up correctly.
X3
YOU GUYS TOTALLY ROCK !!! lol i got home and unplugged the reverse lights that did happen to be plugged in the same side as the distributor and BINGO, instant reverse. Thank you all for your input, been struggling with it for some time. Been in the automotive world my whole life but am brand new to the world of VW and has been a fun experience so far.
Book
Though I would pirate this thread. I also have a 70 AS with orginal air filter. It has been gutted of all the flaps, cables, thermostats ect. I would like to make it functional again. It is now mounted on my Keifernet 34 PICT.
1. Any diagrams of the parts that I need
2. If they are still available where would be the best place to start my search?
Thanks
Bob
Hiya Bob,
Getting a diagram of an air filter for a 70 might be tough. Most all of the parts diagrams I have seen speak to the air filter models that superceeded the thermo cable type air filter on a 70. And, even at that, VW apparently considered the air filter a unit. I have never seen an exploded diagram of any VW air filter. If anybody out there in VWARland has acces to such an exploded diagram please post it up.
Parts (such as the internal flaps and plastic flap clips) are not aftermarket items. If you need these parts (as you obviously do) your best bet is to hit a salvage yard. The good and the bad of this is............many of the flaps are interchangeable from one air filter to another. However, the cable controlled flap on a 70 air filter is unique. I'm thinking that your best bet would be simply to buy a complete 70 air filter for your car rather than to try hunting down the parts.
And then there's the cable business............
(http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa85/Bookwus1/Bug/IMG_1631-1.jpg)
You'll have to replicate that cable if you do not already have it. I had the internal cable but I had to find the outside sheath. Got that in a bike shop and I'd bet that they could also round up a suitable replacement for the internal cable. Of course, all this assumes that you do have the correct flapsets installed in your fanshroud right now. And hooking up the cable to the flapset arm takes a bit of special hardware.
All in all, it's a do-able project, but it will take some resourcefulness and perserverance on your part. If you have any questions or need more information, post your questions up here. My car is being painted right now and I'll be able to get pictures to you after I get it back.
Mike
Thanks for the post. This 70 AS as you know started its life as a single port. It has been changed over to a DP 1641 with the newer style fan shroud and cooler. I dont know if the shroud even has the flapset in it (much less the cable).
To be honest I can't remember the old unit having a flapset installed (someone else did the R&R on the motor). :-[ If you have the diagrams of the fan shround with the flapset in it would you shoot it to me? I assume that the flapset in the shroud isn't available seperately and I'll need to dig up one with the proper components? :(
At the end of the day this may all have to wait until I pull the motor to get the fanshroud off and take a look. Thnaks for the help.
Bob
Hiya Bob,
Here is a diagram of the components for a doghouse fanshroud flapset installation..........
(http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa85/Bookwus1/Bug/Flaps-2-1.jpg)
The components inside the circled area are what you'd need if you are running a doghouse fanshroud. They will be essentially the same if you're running an older singleport fanshroud, but the connecting bar (#31) will be changed to the singleport model (#30)
More importantly there is another difference you should note. Take a look at #23. That's the right hand flapset. Here it is along with the left flapset.........
(http://i201.photobucket.com/albums/aa85/Bookwus1/Bug/IMG_1268-1.jpg)
Right is on top in this picture. In this picture you are looking at the flapsets from the front of the car perspective. The correct flapset for your application has an arm that extends rearward (and when the flapset is in place inside the fanshroud, the arm extends outside the fanshroud to connect to the air filter cable) from the flapset. That arm is attached to the other side of the arrowed pivot shaft. You gotta have that arm. Sorry I don't have a better picture.
Actually, these flapsets are available. You just have to make sure that you have the correct one for your application. If you like, I can check through my parts. I'm pretty sure I do have the correct flapset - maybe the entire set-up.
Hey Mike
I will taker a look tomorrow and see what I have/don't have on my car. I'll post what I need. If you got the parts that would be great. Rather spread the $$ to my AS friends. I'll start looking for an air cleaner with all the needs components also. Thanks
Bob
Ignore the text in the picture.
Is the fuel pump in the picture an alternator version?
(http://i625.photobucket.com/albums/tt333/Warbow_Halo/30pict-2-3.jpg)
Hiya War,
Yep, that's an "alternator special".
Notice that it is angled away from the alternator position. A generator fuel pump will sit straight up and down relative to the case. You can use an alternator fuel pump in a generator application, but not vice versa.