A little bit of seal help pleaseeeeee!!!!!!!!!!!

whyfat2002 · 19 March 2008, 22:35

Ok so not to long ago I had to take my engine out to repair stripped head bolts. in the process the torque converter was removed. when I put the tc and engine back in I did not replace the seal between the tc and tranny.(stupid stupid stupid me) Now it leaks so I am going to replace it. I went a head and ordered a new 68-70 black tc seal from CIP1 #001-301-083. but before I take the engine out a second time I want to know for sure how to remove and replace the seal. from the way the seal looks, the bigger part goes in the tranny. it almost looks like the tranny has to be taken apart to get it in. I even have a photo of the seal:

from what I understand the black rubber part goes against the tc and the rest of the seal is inside the tranny shaft area. so how the heck do you get it in there? is the whole seal rubber so its easy to bend and manipulate it in? and once I got it in, what is all this talk of peening and stamping it? does that mean I just hit it real hard with a hammer?

greenghia · 20 March 2008, 01:43

When you get your converter out you will readily see the seal and it will be apparent how it goes back on. There is a snout sorta thing that is part of the trans housing that extends into the bell housing. The seal you have will go on that housing. No disassembly of the trans is necessary as nothing about the seal is in there. Some people, after installing the seal, take a small punch and peen from the outside of the metal part of the seal to make a more secure fit onto the trans housing. The inside of the metal seal housing is rubber coated so I have never found it necessary to do but it makes some folks feel more secure with the dimples(peening). You can remove the old seal with a small pry bar or straight claw hammer or brake spoon type lever. Easiest thing to do. Takes all of 3 minutes. good luck

hercdriver · 20 March 2008, 02:31

Is this something you should do every time the engine is removed?

tmea · 20 March 2008, 03:52

It will be obvious how it goes back in when you get the TC off. I replaced my 68 for the first time a couple of months ago. A note of caution: Ensure you peen the new seal back on! When you re-fit the new one and get it seated you will see that it does not fit on very tightly over the snout. To correct this, I lightly peened (with a screwdriver) the outside of the metal portion in three or four places to ensure it did not come off.

Again, you will see this when you get it back on. It just won't fit very tightly. I belive it is a wise move to replace this seal every time you have the TC off. Finally, there are two different seals for the TC. One red and the other black. One with the spring garter on the outside and the other in the inside. The red one is allegedly for older models. This has been a topic of much debate on this furum. I now have both types as spares and have measured the sealing and mating surfaces of both and there is no measurable difference between them. Just the garter position and color. Mine is a stock 68 and I used the more readly available red (later) seal on it. I now have about 1,500 miles on it and not the slightest hint of a leak!

Good luck with this! Aside from the drudgery of removing the engine it is not a difficult job. Let us know how it goes.

Tom

68autobug · 20 March 2008, 05:05

Hi
here is a photo of the torque converter oil seal

this is the old seal which was red...

I've painted it yellow so it can be seen easily..

the new seal is covered over with tape..
until I installed the torque converter

when installing the torque converter
make sure You push it on lightly and turn it back and forth until
all the splines have engaged...

the reason the torque converter SEAL is replaced is because it goes hard
and works perfectly until the torque converter is unbolted
then pressure is put on the bottom of the seal
because its hard, it dents slightly, and doesn't go back to fit perfectly
when the torque converter is installed...

I have two TC seals that I have taken out but could be reused as they are like new and very pliable...

cheers

Lee

http://community.webshots.com/user/vw68autobug

Bookwus · 20 March 2008, 06:44

Hiya Dave,

Quote from: hercdriver on 20 March 2008, 02:31
Is this something you should do every time the engine is removed?

Not really.

Replacing the TC seal is something you do every time the Torque Converter is removed. Actually some have even carefully removed the Torque Converter and continued to use the old seal, but it is a good idea to change it out for new. So.......when removing the engine simply make sure that you hold the TC in place as shown in your Bentley and you have no worries about the seal.

68autobug · 20 March 2008, 08:39

When its said - to renew the torque converter oil seal every time
the torque converter is removed
its taken for granted that the oil seal has been in the car for many years...
heat actually is the cause that the torque converter fails after any movement...

I have three seals that i can reuse
as they are soft and pliable as the new ones I have..
the original seal that I installed in My original gearbox about 10 years ago
was never replaced and i had the torque converter out about 6-8 times
but the car only did a few thousand kms.. over the past 2 years..
and the seal had never been hot... and hadn't gone hard..

make sure You lubricate the seal -
{as with All oil seals }- a couple of drops of ATF onto the lip of the seal
will stop it from wearing prematurely...
I was just reading that all oil seals should weep a bit of oil/ATF etc...
as they must be lubricated when in use...
and not to take any notice of slight weepage...

Well, I've always taken notice of any weepage !!
and have replaced many oil seals that have weeped
mainly in FWD cars....

As Mike said - You will see the T/converter oil seal once the torque converter
is taken off...

Best of luck

Lee

http://community.webshots.com/user/vw68autobug

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Best to buy Two Torque converter oil seals - good to have a spare --[/glow]

hercdriver · 20 March 2008, 15:27

Replacing the TC seal is something you do every time the Torque Converter is removed. Actually some have even carefully removed the Torque Converter and continued to use the old seal, but it is a good idea to change it out for new. So.......when removing the engine simply make sure that you hold the TC in place as shown in your Bentley and you have no worries about the seal.
[/quote]

Too late. It came off with engine when I pulled it. Sounds like another project before the engine returns to it rightful place. Glad I found out now versus after the engine went back into the car.

whyfat2002 · 21 March 2008, 00:18

thank you greenghia and everyone else for your help. as soon as the new seal gets here in the mail I will pull the engine and replace the seal. wish me luck

68autobug · 21 March 2008, 06:29

Quote from: hercdriver on 20 March 2008, 15:27
Too late. It came off with engine when I pulled it. Sounds like another project before the engine returns to it rightful place. Glad I found out now versus after the engine went back into the car.

Hi
Was the torque converter still bolted to the flexplate??
as i just took My engine out and the torque converter stayed there..
I took the four bolts out of the torque converter/flex plate first..
thru the square hole on the RHS of the bell housing..

best of luck

I hope everything goes OK for you

Lee

Bookwus · 26 March 2008, 19:11

Hiya Dave,

Quote from: hercdriver on 20 March 2008, 15:27 .........Too late. It came off with engine when I pulled it. Sounds like another project before the engine returns to it rightful place. Glad I found out now versus after the engine went back into the car.

Whatcha gonna do (where are you going to go) for a new seal?

Reason I ask is that I have extra 001-301-083B seals. These are the later model seal which your car would want. My asking price is $20 a seal, cheaper than most of the parts houses.

Interestingly, of the four seals I have one is red and the other three are black but ALL are the later model "B" seal.

hercdriver · 28 March 2008, 02:52

Lee,

I didn't take those four bolts out when removing the engine. I won't make that mistake again. I've taken them out since then. And am now thinking of painting the TC. Nothing fancy just, grey.

Mike,
Sold. I'll take one. I can send you a check or paypal you. Just let me know.

Dave

Bookwus · 28 March 2008, 06:03

Hiya Dave,

Let me figure out the postage back to Beaver and I'll get back to you.

Bookwus · 28 March 2008, 18:57

Hiya Dave,

Check your My Messages. You have a PM.

hercdriver · 03 June 2008, 16:19

I just pulled the old seal yesterday and put the new one on after applying a thin film of ATF on the rubber. As per the Bentley I pressed it in evenly. The problem is that the seal is about a 1/16 off the face of the housing. I thought I remember the original being flush. Should I let it go? I'm afraid any more force on the face of the seal will distort it.

Dave