weber carb and pertronix ignition upgrade

singlecab61 · 12 July 2009, 04:31

Hello all!

I'm not sure I can help out with the progressive setup, but...I can give a pointer or 2 if you still need it. I have A 1969 A/S bug with dual KADRONS. I had to do some mods to get the blasted thing to shift. Two of the things I had to do were relocate the ATF behind the back seat on the right, and relocate the CV to just above the heater pipe car inlet on the left side under the firewall. I had my fair share of bad word tossing while setting up the carbs as well. I had to drill into the side of one of my carbs to get the correct control valve shift signal. Just be careful when drilling if you haven't done it yet, carbs can be expensive if you fubar it! I can post a pic or 2 of my setup if anyone would like.

Good luck!
-Evan

volkenstein · 12 July 2009, 13:44

Pix are great!! Don't think, just do it! On the plus side, it's one less carb set-up to guesstimate with. From your description the ATF filler cap etc interferes with the KADS? Food for thought for sure.

Regards
Sean

singlecab61 · 13 July 2009, 06:58

Quote from: volkenstein on 12 July 2009, 13:44
Pix are great!! Don't think, just do it! On the plus side, it's one less carb set-up to guesstimate with. From your description the ATF filler cap etc interferes with the KADS? Food for thought for sure.

Regards
Sean

Hey there!

To answer your question Sean, yes, the carbs interfere with the ATF cap and most of the filler neck. Also, the CV interferes with the left side carb. Both will have to moved to clear KADRONS. I am 99.9% sure the same goes for dual WEBERS as well. ANYWAY.....Here are pics of not just the engine but, what I nicknamed the Spotted A.S.S. (stands for: paint Spotted Automatic Stick Shift). My 1969 A/S:

Crappy looking, but a work in progress:

Ridded the bug of the ugly '68-later black foam dash cover and added gauges:

I made sure to install an ATF temp gauge just because. I had a radiator repair shop boil out the ATF tank and weld in an 1/8" pipe bung into the bottom of the tank for the temp sensor (not visible in pic):

The complete 1641cc engine:

Right side, notice no ATF tank. You can probably see the ATF tank to carb clearance issue:

Left side, notice no CV and a right angle 1/2'' heater hose end from the vacuum tank. I only used the 90degree part of the heater hose, it is connected to -8AN PUSHLOK hose. (PUSHLOK hose is just as strong as the steel reinforced braided hose needed for the CV). Also note the small vacuum line placement for the CV shift reference. (Not visible in the pic: Got the CV manifold vacuum from TEE'ing off the manifold equalizer hose and routed it out the back engine tin. I opened up the equalizer hose to the required 12mm for sufficient clutch servo vacuum) You can also probably see the CV to carb clearance issue:

New home for the CV (it is hard to see, but it is there). Shot taken as if you were to rest your head against the CYL. 3&4 valve cover and looked toward the front of the car. (You can see the left rear shock on the far left of the pic if that helps orient the picture better.) CV is on the bottom of the firewall, just above the cabin heater inlet hose on the LR of the vehicle, (the factory CV mounting plate is attached to the 3 shiny nylock nuts):

New home for the ATF tank. Behind the rear seat on the right side of the car. The Steel braided AN line is the new pump supply line from the bottom of the ATF tank. I routed it straight down and out to on top of the right side of the tranny. I then routed it down and through the back of the CYL 1&2 side bottom engine tin (the one the heater box screws to) under the pushrod tubes to connect to the A/S pump. The return hose had to be lengthened approximately 8" to reach the ATF tank inside the car:

The new inlet to the A/S pump. This is where I said the supply line was routed. The blue thing on the far right side of the pic (hard to see) is a cleanable oil filter I installed in the line to catch any oil pump damaging debris. The A/S pump is on the far left of the pic:

I was going for a clean look and used a lot of AN line and fittings. VERY EXPENSIVE but the result is well worth it! Also, it was the only way to adapt up to the factory ATF lines/fittings in a couple of instances.

Also...With the exception of the 90degree heater hose elbow, all CV and servo hose is the -8 AN PUSHLOK hose. To prevent the heater hose elbow from crushing under high vacuum, I stuffed a spring inside the hose. I got the spring from the local hardware store.

More pics than needed but I hope this helps out anyone trying to install a set of KADRONS to their A/S. It isn't very easy, but it can be done!

Bookwus · 13 July 2009, 07:35

Hiya Evan,

Excellent pics. You did quite a bit of "creative engineering" to get everything together. Nice job!

This will be a great reference for anybody considering dualies in the future.

singlecab61 · 13 July 2009, 07:54

Thanks Mike! Anything to help out a A/S driver/tinkerer. The next thing is to get some pics of how to setup Dual WEBERS. I will eventually be upgrading the Spotted ASS to an 1835cc. Not sure if I want to run my set of Dual WEBER 40's or stay with the Dual KADRON's. Not for a few years though, or until I want more power. If I go with the WEBERs I will definitely post more pics and better how-to's as I am building the setup.

volkenstein · 13 July 2009, 13:29

Evan,
Neat install! I see now why the ATF tank had to go, it would've jammed up the carb something fierce!
Who sells AN Pushlok? I love anodised bling

.
Plenty on the Commando, none on the A-S!

Ooo, 010 or 019? Either is damnably exxy and hard to find here..

Regards
Sean

Bookwus · 13 July 2009, 13:37

Hiya Sean,

Quote from: volkenstein on 13 July 2009, 13:29

Plenty on the Commando, none on the A-S!

Commando? As in Norton Commando?

singlecab61 · 13 July 2009, 21:50

Quote from: volkenstein on 13 July 2009, 13:29
Evan,
Neat install! I see now why the ATF tank had to go, it would've jammed up the carb something fierce!
Who sells AN Pushlok? I love anodised bling .
Plenty on the Commando, none on the A-S!

Ooo, 010 or 019? Either is damnably exxy and hard to find here..

Regards
Sean

I get my AN goodies from my speed shop the next city over. If the place sells AN, they can usually get PUSHLOK hose. Your in Aussie land, am I correct? You will have to find a speed shop most likely or go online to JEGS or SUMMIT to find AN.

As far as the Dizzy, its an 010. I had my body shop buddy repaint it for me. I also have a real 019 blue screamer that he repainted and matched the color perfectly.

THESAMBA is one of the only places to find these Dizzys but the sellers usually know what they have and want big $$$ for them. You can get lucky at a swap meet, that is where I found my 019 and 010.

volkenstein · 14 July 2009, 01:46

Evan,
A-N hose, fittings etc we can get, I should've asked "who" makes PUSHLOK. Most of my bling is Earl's, although we have homegrown. I do get most of my larger stuff from JEGS/Summit as prices are stupid here.

Mike,
Yes, 850 Mk111. Although it is far from that now. 940 cc's of "Donk of Doom" with twin 34 Amal smoothbores and sewer pipe exhausts feeding a C/R gearbox. But it's another story. I'm only one W/E away from finishing room renovations and I've sworn that the beast will pull a Lazarus by 31/12/09

.

Regards
Sean

Bookwus · 14 July 2009, 01:53

Hiya Sean,

Oh yeah!

I really liked those earlier 750s...........the Street Scrambler. I'm a sucker for up-pipes.

What do you do with 940 cc worth of power? You can hit Warp 3 with that, couldn't you?

volkenstein · 14 July 2009, 02:12

Hi Mike,
Yes, those "S" models were truly horn!

I'm just praying it doesn't kick back, and then once it's going that it doesn't "grenade"

.

Too much time, money & emotion have gone into it....

Regards
Sean

singlecab61 · 14 July 2009, 02:16

Hey there,

The manufacturer of PUSHLOK hose is Aeroquip. JEGS has it available. Here is a link of what the stuff looks like. I used my downtown Speed Shop instead:

http://www.jdaent.com/push-loc-hose-aqp.html

Hope this helps out!

-Evan

volkenstein · 14 July 2009, 03:03

Evan,
Thanks. I'll take a sticky at your link.

Regards
Sean

johnr · 14 July 2009, 16:44

Bookwus: I saw your reply about the Weber getting warm enough to work properly. I noticed my '71 with a 34pic3 spit and farted all winter long. When the weather here warmed up (sw Oregon) the problem all but disappeared except for a few minutes when first started. Was my problem caused by a too cool carb?

Bookwus · 14 July 2009, 17:11

Hiya John,

That certainly is a possibility.

I'm not that far away from you and Oregon weather is really not so extreme (OK, this last winter was a doozy!) to have that much affect on the carb/engine combination IF everything is in working order. So, that makes me think that you might have problems with blocked heat risers. Or possibly your choke.