Starter Motor for an AS

[NOVA Ghia Owner]

Is the Starter Motor for an AS the same as used on the manual transmission cars?

[Cobey]

No, they are different.  The Auto is more heavy duty and doesn't require the bushing like the manual.

[68AutoBug]

The automatic Beetle starter motor is a High torque starter Motor and has More Horsepower than the standard starter motor...
The numbers on My starter Motor are: Bosch 0 001 212 005 006
VW  008 911 023A
I managed to find a spare on ebay...
Seller didn't know it would fit a manual beetle... & I didn't tell Him....
Was very cheap....
I have a photo of it if You want one....
I don't know how to post a pic here..

Lee Noonan   68AutoBug   Australia

http://community.webshots.com/user/vw68autobug



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[68AutoBug]

Hi again,
I have heard that the starter motor from an air cooled VW BUS fully automatic will also fit...
I would also think that a starter from a fully auto type 3 would also fit ...  type 4
They look entirely different to a standard starter motor, so many people think they won't fit a standard manual gearbox/engine ...
so don't tell anyone....
and they won't get used by non auto owners.....    

Lee Noonan   68AutoBug   Australia

http://community.webshots.com/user/vw68autobug

[NOVA Ghia Owner]

Thanks.  I bought a new Bosch starter from Jbuggs.  The manual is quite different from the AS starter.

Everything is back together and running pefect.  I put a new hot start relay in with it.  This thing cranks over so quickly and strong now, you need to be careful to not hold the key or you will grind the motor.

[Achilles]

I don't know what you mean by a 'hot start relay', but it sounds like something I'd like to add.  Please explain.

[NOVA Ghia Owner]

Its also known as a Hard Start Relay.  The problem is due to the peculiar nature of the VW wiring, particularly on a Karmann Ghia where the battery is all the way in the back in the engine compartment.  Current to start the car must go from the battery all the way to the ignition switch and then back to the starter.  Its a long run of wire compared to what you would typically see in a car with the engine and battery mounted in the front of the car.

Over time, as the wire ages and electrical contacts become corroded, resistance builds in the wire.  This is magnified in a hot climate where heat further increases the resistance.  As I recall, the problem first appeared in California years ago as a result of the warm climate (and probably also a high concentration of VWs).  It is further magnified by the air cooled design of the vintage VW engine where there is no liquid cooling system.  The starter is tucked way up by the engine/transmission and can act like a heat sink.

Putting in a relay helps to solve the problem as the relay acts like a switch and the starting current does not have to travel all the way forward and all the way back.  Its right there via the short run from the battery.

The following link from Wolfsburg West's site is an excellent reference and provides some good illustrations.

http://www.wolfsburgwest.com/wired/wired_03_01/wired_03_01.htm

[Achilles]

Excellent info, thanks!

[68AutoBug]

I have always added this starting system to My air cooled VWs...
It should have been standard, as its cost is minimal...
As Your Car gets older the copper wire and connectors get contaminated & You lose some conductivity.....
The strap connecting the gearbox to the chassis should be taken off and cleaned at both ends on both sides.. New bolts/nuts should be used....
cadmium plated or stainless steel are best...
same with the battery ground strap....
all connectors including the fusebox need to be cleaned.... a small wire brush or rotary wire brush in a battery operated drill is good....
[battery needs to be disconnected to do this]
The cleaner the copper is... the brighter the lights will be... etc..

Lee Noonan   68AutoBug    Australia

http://community.webshots.com/user/vw68autobug


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[jeff_wee]

i know you can buy a starter motor for autosticks from http://www.800luvbugg.com/shop?frame=2.83.5000
they sell them rebuilt.

i saw it in their magazine one day and was quiet shocked haha.

[BTL069]

they also have the auto starter in CIP1, brand new and cheaper than the rebuilt starters sold by 800luvbugg.com

[68AutoBug]

Freight would be a killer to Australia though....

they are very similar to a high torque starter motor....

they are better built too and have more torque than a standard starter..

cheers

[NOVA Ghia Owner]

Yes, there is a substantial difference in the size of the AS starter.  It is a much heavier duty unit than what comes with the manual transmission cars.  The starter for the manual transmission looks almost like a toy in comparison.

Freight to Austalia would be a bear.  The cost from CA to Virginia was US$25!

[68AutoBug]

DONSCO Performance in California have AutoStick starter motors for $69-95..  I believe they are New units...

Very good to see...

Lee  68AutoBug     Australia...

http://community.webshots.com/user/vw68autobug

[Tim]

Ok all this starter talk is making me nervous. My 69 AS has a 67 engine. I did not do it so I'm not sure what modifications were done. I can say it does turn over very well. Is there anything else I might look into? I am sure the engine came from a standard. BTW it was the neutral switch in the shifter that was giving me trouble. All set now,  and I've put about 600 miles on it in a week. Yippee.